Service Based Business Society Podcast

Season: 2
Episode: 9
Title: Boundaries Barb is Back

Hello, and welcome to the service based business society podcast. I'm your host, Tiffany-Ann-Bottcher. Our weekly episodes we will take into everything you need to know about scaling your service based business without losing sleep. With my experience in creating over seven figures per month, and a passion for marketing, finance and automation, this show will provide tangible tips and techniques for scaling your business. Let's get started.

Tiffany:
Hey, guys, welcome back to another episode. This week, we have a returning guest from season one. And I am so excited to have her back in the studio. To this day, her episode in Season One is one of the most downloaded episodes. And honestly, I've also had probably the most conversations about the topic, whether it be with clients, or I refer back to it in other workshops or seminars. You know, honestly, whether it is personal or professional boundaries are essential to your own happiness, not necessarily the happiness of everyone else. And I think that for me, personally, I've always struggled to implement boundaries in a way that doesn't offend others. And so because I don't enjoy offending others, I really shy away from boundaries, unless I've really let something get too far. And then when I try to put boundaries in, it's often really too late. And it's an uncomfortable shift. So I think back to the last time Barb was in the studio, and I just loved the episode. So when it came up the opportunity to have our back in for season two, I was super excited. So we're gonna welcome Barb. She is from higher power coaching and is a boundaries coach. So whether it's personal or professional boundaries, or after Barb truly doing some incredible work. So welcome to the show. Barb, welcome back bar, we are so excited to have you back.

Barb:
Me too. Thank you so much for inviting me back.

Tiffany:
No problem. You know, it's one of these things where we can look at, you know, which episodes have had lots of downloads, and also one of the, you know, the episodes I refer back to when I'm working with clients and whatnot. And, you know, as I kind of mentioned in the intro, I just feel like this is so important, and something I personally struggle with so hard. And so I want to have you back.

Barb:
Excellent. Well, thank you so much. I hear you. I mean, I was 52 when I got into recovery, which is where I learned to have boundaries, and I struggled for a really long time. And my life is qualitatively improved immeasurably because of having healthy boundaries. And so I want that for other people, especially women, business owners, especially women business owners.

Tiffany:
Yes, one of the things that I still remember from your first episode was really this discussion about, you know, not having a boundary, but then having resentment for someone who was basically like overusing or, you know, was really not respectful of a non existent boundary and really kind of having this like bitter relationship with and not necessarily with the person because usually keep that kind of stuff, you know, internal locked down, but it is that like bitter undertone of someone who is crossing this boundary that actually has never been put in place.

Barb:
Right, right. Yeah, agreed. And I think that's one thing I tell my clients all the time, like, one indicator of it's either time to set a boundary or reinforce a boundary is when you're feeling resentful against people. I know. Like, for me, I did a lot of volunteering before I got into recovery. I mean, I do a lot of volunteering now. But I do it all in recovery by choice. And you know, I'm happy to give it but I would get upset with somebody like they asked me 50 times. Well, the reason they asked me 30 times was because I said yes, 49 times. Right. So I've trained them to keep coming to me. And I've made myself indispensable to people and then I get resentful of them for not respecting a boundary, which as you said, you didn't state it. And so that's a really good indication. Hmm, maybe I need to set a boundary here. Because I think you know, one of the things that's really common for people that don't have healthy boundaries, they actually don't know like, who they are, or what their standards are, because they've been doing so much people pleasing and so focused on what other people want or need, or what is the situation require. What does the organization require that they haven't given any thought at all to themselves and what they want and need? And so the experimentation process of trying to figure out well, you know, what is my boundary? Well, I'm telling you, or resentment is a good indicator of like, there was a place where a boundary would be well served. And, you know, I used to think I was nice, you know, before I had healthy boundaries. And the thing is when you're walking around, resentful of people, when you're saying you're being dishonest and saying yes to things that you really want to say no to, like, for me personally, I came to understand I was doing these things. Yeah, I wanted to be helpful. But more importantly, I wanted people to think I was nice or to think I was helpful or kind or whatever. So that's called manipulation. None of that is nice. That's not nice. And so what I say to people is, I think being kind is more the thing to focus on. So kind people tell the truth, kind people say yes. When they mean yes, they say no, when they mean No, kind people directly communicate with others, and ask for what they want instead of trying to manipulate. So I hope that that's helpful in hearing that.

Tiffany:
Yes, I remember the first time you said, you know that it was dishonest. And I'll be honest, I haven't felt that moment of like punch in the get on any other episode where I was like, oh, no, because it is being dishonest. But you don't in your mind, you don't think of it that way. You really just kind of go along with it as someone who really focused on the end objective, I guess, sometimes almost allowing the process not to really be what it should be in order to get to the end goal.

Barb:
Yeah, so this is why you need a boundaries coach, because who's going to tell you, you know, like, that's being dishonest. And then, you know, I think like, when you just said that what occurred to me was, it sounds like you're saying the ends justify the means. And there are some situations in life where you know, that's true, like if someone's life is at stake. But what I try to focus on, especially with women that I coach, who are business owners, is the means it does not like the end does not justify the means the way you go about doing something informs what it is you're trying to create. And so what I tried to do is help women identify what are my top five values, and then create action plans toward sticking to those values because like, I want to be a woman who was honest, like I really like you said, I didn't know that I wasn't honest, I didn't know that I was lying. And then like I happen to be in recovery for a substance problem, as well as codependence and all that and so I was lying about all that stuff. I lied about cigarettes, I lied about drugs, I lied about alcohol, I lied about food, and all that stuff. But somehow I didn't couch that as dishonest. And then there were all the people pleasing that I was doing. And so now I'm living in alignment with my values. And another way to talk about that is to say, to be in integrity. And so it's a lot easier for me to not want to seek out substances, etc. Because I'm living in integrity. I don't need to numb myself because I'm living in the way that I want. And the way that I think about it, integrity is another way of saying your whole. So for example, my podcast is called fragmented to whole life lessons from 12 step recovery, because that was my experience. It was as if I had been these fragmented pieces, and boundaries, and the process of recovery helped me integrate them into one coherent whole. So I also got rid of the fragments that weren't genuinely me. And so now I'm whole, and I can be rocked by things that happened to me, but I can't be shattered by them. Because I'm whole. And when really difficult things happen to me, which of course they do. It doesn't take away from my wholeness the way that it used to. So I had a situation a few months ago, that was like in a business networking group, and I kind of screwed up essentially, is what I did, and I owned it. I did the best that I could. And when I was leading up to the situation where I screwed up, I actually thought it through, prayed about it, asked higher power for guidance, and did the thing. And then it didn't really turn out that well. And so in the past, I would have just raked myself over the coals for that. But instead of doing that, I used it as info, not ammo. This is one of my favorite sayings. So it's information for me to learn and grow from. It is not ammunition to beat myself up. And I thought about okay, there was something I was missing. That was the part like I couldn't have seen that. So I did everything. I did it in line with my values. I prayed about it. I thought about it, I connected with my higher power about it. If somebody else wants to hold me to a higher standard than that, go ahead. I don't know what else that higher standard would be. Once I got the new information. I was like, Oh my bad. I'm sorry. Here's what I'm going to do to repair the situation, and here's what I'm going to do to make sure this doesn't happen in the future. And so the fact that I was hoping that I was living in alignment with my values and that I was in integrity allowed me to hit the ground running in terms of repairing it, it didn't take me down the way that it would have in the past, I didn't allow the other person to define me. And to decide what kind of a person I am, I get to decide what kind of person I am. And I'm a woman who has integrity. And I can't tell you what that did. For me, it was a huge learning experience, for many reasons. But the idea, like the experience of being really solid, and my values, just really carried me through that.

Tiffany:
Yeah, it's interesting, when you really route it back to something rather, you know, when you say, like, I need to whatever I do, I need to be in integrity, I need to be in alignment. And then your actions really are guided by that really end objective there, you know, going back to my original kind of statement about the objective, the objective is to maintain integrity and be in alignment, that is the objective,

Barb:
Right, right. And you can do all of those things and have a really successful business. And I would argue, you're going to have a more successful business when you're acting out of your integrity, because you're going to attract people for whom your type of integrity works, like my package of values is different than your package of values. And so if you and I are competitors, My people are going to be attracted to me and your people are going to be attracted to you, as long as you're consistently going through, you know, in acting out your values.

Tiffany:
That's true.You know, it's one of my kind of online business friends, she has a Facebook community, and she actually shared a post just this morning. And it made me think of our upcoming recording, she had shared, someone had reached out to her on the weekend, she doesn't work weekends, she is actually quite open about the fact that she doesn't work weekends. So I think if anyone had been, you know, around in her group and whatnot, you would know that that is, but new person maybe didn't know, and they had sent, you know, a message, basically, it was fairly, maybe passive aggressive would be the word, but basically just like, obviously, you don't care and like we're not going to work together. So you know, that is what it is. And she responded back. And you know, in those situations, I don't. I kind of thought for him, I wondered how I would have responded, I thought, Oh, I would have answered on the weekend because I'm getting those boundaries. And then, you know, she said, Oh, I'm really sorry for not getting back to you. You know, I don't work weekends. But I, you know, I'm happy to talk about it. Now, if you're still interested. And in the end, the person was like, oh, sorry, I didn't know when you know, it's very interesting how quickly the conversation turned around. And how she just really just stayed firm on the fact that she hadn't actually really done anything wrong. Right. But you know, it was interesting to me how quickly it turned around, though, and how the person that's like, oh, great, like Glad you're still interested. Let's move forward. And yeah, I found it interesting.

Barb:
Yeah, you know, that's an ideal situation, it doesn't always happen that way. A lot of times, I would say the two most difficult things about having boundaries are one: the emotions that come up for you and dealing with the pushback from people. So a lot of times people are pushing back. But like in this case, like you said, that was probably a new person who didn't understand. And so this is one reason why letting people know the boundaries ahead of time is so helpful, because they know what I call it, like the terms of engagement, they know what the terms of engagement are. So they don't have an expectation that you're going to answer on the weekend. If you're like, Oh, she closes the door, at five on Fridays, you know, so I'm not going to end if I need someone who works on weekends, that's not my person. You know, and this is why it's easier to train people up from the very beginning, like bringing in new clients with their new boundaries. And then, you know, it is harder to retrain the former clients with the ongoing clients with your new boundaries. And you know, sometimes that's where you start, you don't start with the new clients. I mean, excuse me, you don't start with the ongoing clients, you start with the new clients. And you see you get reinforcement, oh, this is acceptable behavior. And in fact, this is a lot easier for me, and I'm able to be more productive and more present and make more money when I'm working in this way. And then it makes it easier to introduce those boundaries to the people that you know, you've had around for a while, you know, because you've gotten that reinforcement in multiple ways, you know, the money, the time, the energy, the relief and the relationship and all that stuff.

Tiffany:
You know, one of the relationships I was doing some work for a family member and I won't help them as to who it was but a family member. So the long term client, if you will, the person who has you know, knows the lack of boundaries for my life. And so after, you know, and I thought about it during our last recording, and you know, it took me a few months, back and forth and really feeling this. A little bit of bitterness. I have a relationship that really was kind of being overused and felt very one sided. And I feel like I always, you know, you want people to just understand without setting the boundaries, you know, to respect what I believe would be, you know, acceptable and right. But what I've come to realize is that what everyone views as acceptable is very different. So that's part of it. And I did in the end, put in a boundary and said, I'm uncomfortable working. And I was basically doing a lot of work in their business and not being paid for it, but was paying my team and whatnot. Major businesses don't know. But you know, when people come to you, they are your family, I think that lots of people get pulled into that, you know, it's like, oh, well just click, I can help with this. I can help with this, no problem. But then it goes a little hunger and a little longer, a little longer. And so but when I set the boundary and said, I'm really uncomfortable with this, it did not go well. And the person has not spoken to me since and has, you know, has caused a problem in our families telling everyone that I've, you know, come off, and this is terrible, and blah, blah, blah. And so, it's strange, because I feel this sense of relief to myself, where I know I did the right thing for myself and boundaries, and whatnot. But then your business and my business. Absolutely. Absolutely. It's funny, you know, my team that was working on this business, I never mentioned, it was this family member, because I just didn't really want to be connected. And they always were like this, why don't we work with this car, it was quiet, it never gets back to us like what's going on? Like, you could tell that they didn't understand why we were working for someone that didn't align with, you know, our agency and didn't respond the way everyone else responded. And so they were confused. So they were all very relieved that this was not going on anymore. And, you know, I thought maybe I should have said at the beginning, but once I had kind of gotten going in, I hadn't confessed that it was a family member. So you know, the end result, though, is I feel at peace myself, I know, it was the right thing to do. But I, you know, come back to this, you know, statement that I made a long time ago to you is that, when I put in boundaries, it's not well received. But I know it's the right thing. So it's kind of, you know, it is keeping that integrity in mind. And also, you know, I had the conversation with my husband saying, you know, we have bills to pay, you know, business is the business and I need to make, and typically, I am very analytical and you know, data focused and whatnot. But when it comes to family, I don't know, I don't know, you just allow things to happen that you wouldn't do for anybody else.

Barb:
Right? Yeah. So several things come to mind from what you said. One is that we want people to read our minds, we want them to know. And so that's not how it works. I just gonna say that, get it on the record. Yeah, how it works. The other is, you know, you didn't say they should know. But that's sort of like what you're implying. And you realize, oh, we all have different standards of what common senses are. And the thing is, if people should know something than they would, they clearly don't. And so we need to tell them. And then the other thing that occurs to me to say is, you know, if you have a business and you want to help out family, and friends, go ahead and do it, but name, the terms of engagement from the beginning, I will give you up to 10 hours, I will work on this for a week, I will give you three images, if you're a graphic design, like name, the terms of engagement, and then after that, I'm either going to refer you to someone else, or I'm going to start charging you at the regular rate. So if you do that, then you prevent the resentment, you have created the expectation for them right from the get go. And I think a lot of the difficulty that happens in the world with people is that we have unrealistic expectations. So that person had an unrealistic expectation of what they quote deserved from you, which was free service for whatever eternity I don't really know. Right? So the way that we can get our family and friends in line with reality, and our expectations is by naming what you're willing to do. And I think, you know, one of the things I loved how you said I am uncomfortable with that is one of the things that I feel like sometimes I'm not sure what the boundary needs to be, but the way I start the conversation is I'm really uncomfortable with this. And then I just see how that lands, because the way they respond to that is going to inform how I respond. And it's going to help me kind of figure out like, what is it that's making me uncomfortable? And you know, where do I want to put the boundary? And most reasonable people, when you say you're uncomfortable with something, are going to sympathize with that, I'd want to help you get out of discomfort and get you back into comfort. So that can be a way to start the conversation. And then if you have a client that you've been like a friend or a family member that you've been working with for a really long time, you know, you can say I'm going to stop at x period of like give them a window of time and say, you know, this is no longer working for my business. And so I'm going to have to either start charging you or refer you to someone else. I'm going to give whatever X period of time or hours or whatever it is, to give them a window of time, if you're not comfortable just sort of cutting it right off. That's another way that you might be able to, you know, handle the situation so that it's easier for you to feel like you're sort of creeping up on the boundary, as opposed to just, you know, slamming it down. And it's easier for them to digest, and you've been gentle about it, and that sort of thing.

Tiffany:
Yeah, one of the things that one of the new boundaries that we implemented in our agency, just in the last maybe two months, was we started actually, including for service agreements, what the communication channels are, for each of those services, you know, we have, you know, everything from, you know, $300 SEO type service, that's very, you know, like, you know, you get your monthly report, and this is what we do, but there's no real ongoing communication. And then we have all the way up to full service clients who we, you know, I speak to every single day. And so where we were running into some issues was, if a full service client referred, someone else who ended up on a smaller package, they of course, would have said, who I talked to, you know, so and so at the end of the day, and blah, blah, blah, and this is great. But then if they were on a completely different package, they seemed, you know, like, there was this, you know, lack of understanding as to why they weren't getting that same communication. And so now, I, you know, one of the things because I truly also believe in, you know, clear understanding upfront, and that a lot of times that, you know, unhappiness really stems from, you know, just a lack of clarity people no interest to having the same understanding of the situation. So now, you know, if you want slack communication, then that these programs and above, and if you want, you know, these kind of monthly SEO type packages that email communication, and I think that that has, you know, just establishing that right upfront, so it's not a negative, it's just the way it is right from the beginning truly has changed the way that that feels.

Barb:
Awesome, right? So what you've done is named the terms of the engagement, and policies and procedures are boundaries in business. And if you have policies and procedures in line with your values, whoo, oh, my God, what a happy business you're gonna have. You know, that reminds me. So in addition to having my business I have, so I work for myself. So I have a couple part time jobs, and one is for our co working place, and we have email, and we have slack. And then of course, everybody has my cell phone number. And when I first started working there, the owner was texting me all the time. And I said, I would just say, please email this to me, please email this to me. And I have a number of conversations where I've said to him, if there is something that is urgent, and you have to have the answer right now, then go ahead and text me anything else, it needs to remain an email and slack. Because I only work 10 hours a week for that agency, I work for them when I'm on the clock for them. And that's it. And I had to train him, like, in the beginning, he kept doing it. And I just kept saying, please email this to make these if I'm not gonna remember this, if you don't email it to me, I can, you know, and eventually he got it, he didn't really like it, he still doesn't like it. But that's just the way that it is. If you want me to be present for you, when I'm working for you, then you need to allow me to be present for myself when I'm working for me. And for my other job when I'm working for them. And you need to communicate in a fashion that makes sense. You know, you don't just send me a text message that on Friday, you need to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, send me an email, you know that on Friday. And so I think we can do that in all different areas of our lives. It's not just something that you want to set up in your business, we teach people how to treat us. And what you're saying is we're going to teach our clients how we're going to treat them. And we're going to teach them how to treat us. Right, and then there's no resentment because we're all clear.

Tiffany:
You know, one of the things as we changed the communication piece in our terms and conditions, I actually so we have, you know, the very typical agency legal jargon terms and conditions. And now we also have something that isn't the legal jargon, it is very much these are, this is the way you work with us. And this is what you can expect. Because I think that, you know, you go to, of course everyone has, when they start out their business, they want to be covered. I'm a firm advocate, and making sure that you don't have any skeletons in the closet, and that any potential liabilities are covered and all of these pieces. But at the same point, also, you know, most people don't read the legal jargon, especially if it's super long. And so they scroll to the bottom and sign and say get ready to get started. And so, you know, we've really added in this separate you know, what you can expect when you work with us, and it's not really it's a little more, you know, reader friendly, and it goes through the pieces that are essential to a good working relationship, because I think it's tough when a lot of people are working in the online space. So it's not the same as, you know, reading someone in a desk next to you, you can't look over and be like, Oh, that person's really busy. I won't bother them today. You know, it's different online, and so everyone really just knows their own priorities, knows their own urgencies, and says, Okay, well, I need this, and I want that and whatnot. It's just an entirely different situation. And when we don't, you know, give the information upfront, when we have to implement it later, it is uncomfortable.

Barb:
Right? Right. So this is precisely what you were talking about. Like this, when I was saying, you have an ongoing client and need to teach them how to work with you. And then you have a new client, and you've told them from the get go, you have new boundaries, you have healthy boundaries with them. And that's all they know, of course, that's so much easier, because you've named the terms of the engagement, whereas with the other one, it's like, you're changing the rules of engagement, or you're naming them. And then the other thing like in your before you implemented this policy, it was like this expectation, they should know that this is how we communicate. And they had this expectation, like you gave the example of someone who's a friend of a private client that gets one on one time with you all the time has this expectation. Well, you dissuade them of that expectation by naming the terms of engagement, say, Oh, what do you have this package? This is the type of communication that you're gonna get. And you know, boundaries are about clarity. Because, you know, one of the things in my coaching I talked about, there's a whole big element of learning how to communicate effectively, and using empowered communication with other people. And the thing about boundaries is they're clear, they're not murky, and that means that your communication about them needs to be clear, not murky.

Tiffany:
Yes, absolutely. I even go back to my time in corporate. And one of the things I remember saying to my CEO a long, long time ago, because I had been there for a very long time. And so had started very early on in my career and had gone through a lot of growing and leadership involvement. And, but it was almost like, you know, I said, I unfortunately, I said, I can't be new, I have all of this, you know, I grew up here, really, I mean, I was young, my second year of university when I started there, and was an executive assistant at that time, and ended up growing and changing so much over I was there for 11 years. But it almost felt like I couldn't lose some of the you know, it was like what you're used to, it used to be like, and it's I said, I can't get rid of that unless I leave. Because it felt like you couldn't get that clean slate with this is who I am now, this is how much I've grown. This is how much I've learned. And that was tough. And so I think it's the same thing with the clients. So whether it's in you know, a more like corporate setting, family long term or clients, it's, you know, new is often easier, because it's this, this is what you get now this is, you know, this what you're working with, and it's not these, you know, pieces that you you already have recognized weren't serving the greater purpose, and you've evolved and changed and grown. And not everyone knows that.

Barb:
Right. Yeah, they're not holding on to the old Tiffany, and you get to be like, This is who I am right now. And they only know, you know, the new you. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. That's why it's so hard to establish boundaries in your ongoing relationships. That's the hardest part, because you're really teaching and, you know, we're always teaching people how to treat us. But when we learn how to set healthy boundaries, we're being very purposeful in how we teach people how to treat us. And so we're really teaching the people who've been around us how to treat us. And, you know, unfortunately, like you've learned with this client, family member, sometimes we lose people. And that can be really upsetting. But like, as you said, you know, you did the right thing, you did the right thing for you, you did the right thing for your business. And if they want to go around bad mouthing you, there's really nothing you can do about it. And the way to deal with that is to be in your own integrity, and to know I did the right thing. And so it takes a lot of the sting out of them, perhaps bad mouthing you it doesn't take it entirely away. But if you weren't acting in integrity, that would make it even worse and even more difficult to take. So yeah, the fact is, sometimes you're going to lose people. And when it comes to business, usually the people that you're going to lose are people that are clients that drain it, they're not people that are you know, that you're energized to work with, and you're so happy to get on a call with them and you can't wait to do more work with them. They're usually the people that have been dragging you along the whole time and so fine, you know, they may not be happy and they might badmouth you, but you're gonna now have room to bring in those clients who are in alignment with you. And the way that you do your business and you're going to come at it with a lot more energy and it's going to serve you and your business. Much more in the future.

Tiffany:
Hmm, yeah. When I was growing up, my mom used to watch Oprah and I remember Oprah saying, long time ago, she was talking about how if you go to the buffet and you're not hungry, then you can enjoy everything the Buffet has to offer and that sometimes you have to, you know, make sure that you're hungry. going in. And you know, she was talking about, you know, at the time they were talking about, like letting toxic relationships go so that you could make room for new relationships. And I thought it was a very interesting analogy. I mean, I was probably like 12, or 13, or something, but it really stuck with me as kind of like, oh, gotta be hungry sometimes.

Barb:
Right, right, exactly. Yeah, that is a really good metaphor. And I think we can all identify with, you know, the concept of a buffet. And you're right, it's like, you're not going to be satisfied, if you're already full. Yeah.

Tiffany:
And you're missing out, you're missing out on the potential amazing clients that you do. Because you do have those people that you work with, that you absolutely look forward to every call you want to work with, like, they excite and bring the energy and make room for more of those. It's one of the pieces as I'm working with clients, we often talk about, you know, you have your ideal clients, and then you have clients. And so you know, what is the percentage because you really, when you get started, and you're trying to get your business off the ground, you're a little less picky, and you bring people in and their clients. And so then as your business grows, you know, it's you who wants to get to the point where, you know, the bigger percentage is the, you know, some of the less ideal clients just, you know, they whittle away a little.

Barb:
Right, yeah, I agree. I call them soulmate clients, rather than ideal clients, because they're like, they resonate with me on a soul level in that, it for me, like, I think part of it, because I'm a boundaries coach. That's what I do. And so part of it is, like their personality. But I also want to work with people who want to improve . One of the things I say is, I really like to work with people who are ripe for change. So they know, I'm the one that needs to change, they're not going stones, if they would only do this. And if he would only do that, if she would only do that they're really clear. It's me. And so people that like really, they're hungry for change, like you're saying, you know, being hungry, and they actually do the work. They don't expect to just be on a call with me and magically turn into someone with healthy boundaries. You know, they go through the presentations, they read the readings, they listen to the podcasts, they do the workbook exercises, they have the conversations with the people, they come to me and ask for help when they're getting stuck with something. You know, like, those are the people that I really love to work with. So I hear Yeah, you know, but like, what constitutes a soulmate client, for me might be completely different than for you.

Tiffany:
Absolutely. But I think that hunger goes, you know, whether it's hunger for change really does help with, you know, the coachability factor. You know, like, you can impact someone so much more like you can offer so much more value when they're ready for it.

Barb:
Yeah, I love that you said coachability factor? I'm going to use that I really that's not I mean, as soon as you said like, precisely, that's exactly what I'm talking about. Are you coachable? Right now? Yeah, absolutely. Love it.

Tiffany:
So Barbr, where can people connect with you? And you want to tell us a little bit about these VIP days that Yes, super, super excited about? Yeah, VIP days, I think every person is telling you.

Barb:
So I do a lot of networking with women entrepreneurs, and many of them suck with boundaries. And so I have piloted and now ready to start promoting my feminine biz boundaries VIP days. So this is a one day workshop one on one with one woman entrepreneur, where in one day, we help her create boundaries in her business. And so they can go to better boundaries.com/vip. And I have a special promotion for your listeners. So the first two people listening to this podcast that use this promo code, which you'll put in those show notes, and I'll say in just a moment are going to get $300 off, they have to make this purchase by December 31 2022. So for those of you who are listening in the future, sorry. But you can still come to better boundaries with Barb/VIP. And sign up for a call with me. There's lots of information on the site about exactly what it is, what you get and what we do with the transformation, but you can sign up for a call with me and if it feels like I'm the right person to help you get your needs met, then we'll book your VIP day. I will shower you with attention and gifts and give you all kinds of tools and tips and help hold you accountable to yourself so that you can have your own back and get back to really loving your business the way that you did when you first formed it.

Tiffany:
That is incredible. absolute incredible to me boundaries are the piece of business school that's missing Life School. Yeah, they totally always talk about going back to like high school, why they don't teach you to balance a checkbook and do all you know like the life skills and to me boundaries. And the ability to set boundaries is truly a life skill and a business skill that everyone needs to be leaning in on right now.

Barb:
So the code is SPDs that'll be the code. Of course, when you're on the call with me, I will give you that code, but she'll put it in the show notes too. So I'm really excited to share this with your listeners.

Tiffany:
Awesome. Thank you so much, Barb. And I will be sure to drop that in the show notes. So it's SPBs and I will drop that in.

Barb:
Okay. Thank you so much. Yes. Thank you for inviting me back. What a thrill. This is my first time coming back on a podcast. Oh, yeah. Very excited. Yeah. All right. Thanks.

Tiffany:
Alright, well, we are all out of time for today. If you guys have not joined the surface based business society, Facebook community, make sure you head on over to Facebook and we can continue the conversation. Be sure to also follow the show by going to any podcast app and searching surface based business society. Click subscribe, click the fifth star and leave us a written review. Have a great week and we will see you soon