Service Based Business Society Podcast

Season: 2
Episode: 17

Title: Copywriting and Crime

Hello and welcome to the service-based business society podcast. I'm your host, Tiffany Ann Bottcher. In our weekly episodes, we will dig into everything you need to know about scaling your service-based business without losing sleep. With my experience in creating over seven figures per month, and a passion for marketing, finance, and automation, this show will provide tangible tips and techniques for scaling your business. Let's get started.

Tiffany:
Hello Meg, welcome, welcome.

Meg:
Hello, thank you for having me.

Tiffany:
I'm super excited to dive in and chat with you. I was already recording your intro earlier. And I was like we've got copywriting and coffee and true prime and caught my cool. There are all sorts of goodies here.

Meg:
I love it. I'm in for all of it.

Tiffany:
Awesome. So tell me, how did you get into writing? Have you always liked to write, is that something that you found a passion for later in life? I feel like when the guests we have on the podcast, there seems to be this distinct group of people who knew right off the gate. This was like their thing forever and ever. Or there are these people that have these, like, shifts midlife and find these new passions.

Meg:
Okay, so for me, I definitely am at the first party. It's been always forever and always.

Tiffany:
Yeah.

Meg:
Actually, about a year or two ago, I found a journal from when I was seven. And I had written in there like I was the nerd that totally kept a journal. But I had written in there that when I grow up, I want to listen to old people tell me their stories, and I want to turn them into books. Like that was I knew that. I knew that I wanted to be a ghostwriter when I was seven, it just took me you know, 30 years to come back to that. Eventually. Yeah, so writing has always been my jam. I've always been writing even though I was working in the corporate world for someone else doing a million other things for 20-plus years, writing was always on the sidelines. As someone who loves to write, I feel like I wrote for so long for school, I actually totaled it up recently, I was in school for like, well over 20 years. By the time I did like, you know, an elementary school in high school and university and I MBA whatnot. And I feel like it almost stole the joy out of the writing. Because it was always the reading and the writing, I always love to read and write, but then, you know, it's like, it becomes like this chore, toward, especially towards the end of my MBA my dissertation, I felt like it might kill me. And so you know what I feel like now again because now I've been done school for a while, I feel like I'm starting to find the joy in it again. Oh, that makes me so excited. That's a common thing that I hear, especially with people who are starting their own business and getting back into something that they love, whether it be something they've known, they've loved forever, or they're just discovering this passion, getting to write about something that they really, really love and are excited about. And it's not a task. It's not an assigned book report on the Joy Luck Club. It's something that lights their fire and turns them on so that they start to get excited about writing again. It makes me so happy. I love that.

Tiffany:
So you always knew you wanted to write. Did you know, like you spent some time in corporate then obviously? So how did you make that shift away from corporate and into writing more full-time?

Meg:
So while I was working in corporate, I still had little freelancing gigs. I wrote for a local newspaper and I wrote for some entertainment magazines and publications, just finding a few different options to keep my fingers busy with the writing. Honestly, I had been in the corporate world for a little over 20 years. And it had gotten to the point where the stress and anxiety from doing something and trying to force me to do something I felt like I should be doing to contribute to society and whatnot. It caused me to be drinking a lot and doing a lot of substances that are not meant to be done in large quantities. And honestly, I had some people to call to come to Jesus, I had this realization that I needed to make a change, I either needed to find a way to love what I was doing in the corporate world, and just deal with it, or to do what I did love. And so I set a goal for myself, honestly, it was probably in a drunken stupor, I set this goal where I was like. I give myself one year to figure out either what I want to do with my life or how to deal with what I'm doing right now. And I realized that if I wanted to make a living writing, I needed to write for people that had money, which I was like, okay, that means I need to write for business owners because they have money to spend on writing. So I'll be a copywriter. And so I created my business and set up a website in the course of a couple of weeks and 363 days later, I gave notice to my boss and left the corporate world because it was like I had to make this one-year goal. Did the thing, and started copywriting and it was a blast. But I also knew right away that, copywriting wasn't the format for me, because I needed a little more fluff. I needed the storytelling aspect of it. And so I knew that like, at least in the next five years, I wanted to be ghostwriting, I wanted to be helping people write books, and the universe heard me and she was like, I see you cool, plopped two ghostwriting opportunities in my lap after about five months in business? And I was like, Well, I know if I tell the universe, I'm not ready. Like she may not come back around. So
all right, let's, what's the worst that can happen? Honestly, that's all she wrote. I didn't take on any more copywriting clients. After that, I finished up the contracts that I had. And since then, it's now been about three years of ghostwriting and coaching others on their writing, and I

Tiffany:
Incredible

Meg:
love what I do every day.

Tiffany:
So walk me through the ghostwriting process. I know that I've always been super curious about what that looks like, I have had, you know, different people reach out in the last couple of years who have said, like, hey, like, you should be writing a book and whatnot. And I was like, Yeah, I would love to write about them. They're like, Yeah, I'm gonna write it for you. I was like, No, I want to write it. So what is that process? What is that process? Like? I mean, I enjoy writing. So for me, that was something I was like, I wonder what that would be like, you know, and I've personally, I had already said, No, I wasn't getting any more details at that point. So walk me through, what is that process. Like?

Meg:
I love that. And I totally get that it's, people are in like you said, they're in two parties. There are the people that are like, I want a book, and I'm gonna write it. And then there are the people like I want a book. So those are the people that ghost readings for you. It's fine. One of the biggest questions I get asked is, isn't it illegal? And I'm like, no, no ghostwriting is not plagiarism. It is not stealing someone's work. It is a creative contract and agreement between two parties that says, you have a story that you want to tell, but you either don't want to sit and write it, or you don't know how to write it. Or you just, don't care, too, you have better things to do with your time. And you're hiring someone to help you. That's what ghostwriting is, it is legal.

Tiffany:
My number one thing that prevents me from writing a story, is you know, and I've seen a couple of different people have mentioned it in different ways, as you know, guests on the podcast, but you know, the vulnerability hangover. And so I wrote, as part of a group book, kind of like a Chicken Soup for the Soul type where each person had their own chapter. And I did that just as I was leaving corporate. And I was like, Oh, I've always wanted to be a part of a book. Oh, actually, I said, I always wanted to write a book. And so I was like, oh, one chapter, and it was kind of like the, it was gonna go live just kind of just after I left corporate, and I still, this is kind of fun and whatnot. I remember the first meeting and I, of course, had some ideas and stuff. And then we met with the editor, that first meeting. And she was like, okay, so you're gonna write about this? And I was like, Oh, I don't want to. And I, you know, it was really right, as I was leaving corporate. And so she, of course, wanted me to talk about that decision and whatnot. And I think I would just write it so differently. Now. It was so new. And I was from corporate and incorporated. We didn't say, you know, like, it was like, everything's fine. Life is good, everything's fine. Everything is fine. And so what now as I have been in the online space, and like, I've done my podcast, and you know, like, there's been that focus on more like authentic content. And so you ended up sharing way more about it? And so like, I look at it, and I'm like, Oh, I totally would do it differently now. But of course, that was kind of what it was. And so there's definitely some growth in that time.

Meg:
I guess that's what people see it as, it's the double-edged sword. It's like, okay, but once I put it out there, like a book is forever. It's not an Instagram post, or it can be like, Oh, I don't like it. My chin looks like I'm gonna delete it like, a book is there it is there. It's happening.

Tiffany:
Well, my grandma, of course, was like, she bought it like the day it came out. And so she had it in her hands, like before anybody else. And so she was like, Well, I read it. She was like, you're sharing a lot. Oh, gosh. I was like, if I was nervous before, I'm 100 times more nervous.

Meg:
That's actually one thing that a lot of

Tiffany:
But now looking, you know, at that moment, I just felt so panicky about sharing that side. But you know, it's interesting because it is how you connect with people and one of my best clients who I've now worked with for, like a year and a half, I mean, I've worked so closely in her business and so I, you know, we get to know each other and you share the life and the journey and you. See how that affects each person's business and what they bring from life and towards their business. It's so important to be able to take your story or whatever and actually bring it not to like air, dirty laundry, but in a way that just, you know, this is me, and this is how I do business because this is me. And so I've been able to convey that, in words, I think is truly a gift of whether that's in a story, like in ghostwriting or copy is being able to share the story in a way that helps persuade people to understand.

Meg:
Oh, definitely. Well, and also, I think it's shifting that to seeing it as Yes, it's a vulnerability. But that's so empowering. Because we so often think, Okay, I'm doing it wrong, or I didn't do that as perfectly as I could. And what we need to realize is that there are a million other people that are behind where we are right now. And I don't mean behind, like delayed, but they haven't taken the steps that I've taken that you've taken. And so, yes, us showing up vulnerable and saying, like, Okay, I did it. I wrote my first book after I had emergency back surgery while I was on pain pills and living in a recliner chair in our living room. Like it was messy. It was not a good look. But I was very open about that and very vulnerable and sharing that because I want people to know that, like, you don't have to have a perfect office setup. And you don't have to be perfectly coiffed and have an amazing grasp of the English language. I mean, start where you are with what you have. And tomorrow, you'll be able to look back and say, Wow, okay, I wish I had done it a little differently. But at least I did it.

Tiffany:
Oh, well, because, you know, when I started, it was funny. I remember someone saying, you know, imperfect action is, you know, beats perfection. And I was like now, no, no, no, you know, and this whole, like, Done is better than perfect. And all of these things that when I started my journey of entrepreneurship, I was like, Yeah, I don't subscribe to any of this. None of it. But you do get to the point where you're like, Okay, so I still am a person who does enjoy perfection. And this whole, like anti perfection culture, is not still something I subscribe to. However, I do see that, like, you can wait, you can hold off, you can decide to not move ahead with something like business, whatever it is, because you're just like, I don't know yet. I don't know yet. And opportunities flow on by whether it's hiring someone or acquiring the different part of a business or letting someone go, or, you know, it's like, there are all these decisions within the business that sometimes you have to be decisive, and you have to trust yourself and make a decision and just go for it, whether it's perfect, whether it's that you know, sometimes you just have to go, there is no option to just wait.

Meg:
Yes, honestly, probably, if I were to nail down the biggest thing that I have done that has changed the trajectory of my business, that starting of additional businesses, you know where I am now, it has been in the last year that I have leaned into trusting my higher self. And for some people, that's your gut instinct. It's whatever you want to call it a higher power, your God, the universe, I kind of it's all of the above, you know, D all of the above, but just trusting that, like, I do know best for myself, and I may not have the right answer, but at this point, right now, today, I'm gonna make the best decision that I can. And I guess at the end of the day, as long as the decisions I'm making, like nobody's life is on the line. It's a matter of maybe I post a blog post that doesn't land. Okay. Did anyone die? No, I mean, I really hope nobody did. But like, did anyone die? No. Did it cause a horrible accident? Did it change the course of someone's life? No, I did something that was human. It wasn't perfect. And tomorrow, I could do it better. And just really getting out of my own way. And knowing that my higher self, she knows some shit. She's a smart girl. And I need to listen to her.

Tiffany:
It's interesting how we start to have this shift at one point or another where we do start to trust ourselves more. I mean, I am 100% analytical data-focused, like the numbers, tell the story, yadda, yadda, yadda. And when I left corporate, it was an honor. Like, it's my time I have to go. And I remember like talking to my husband about it or attempting to talk to my husband about it for a long time and he just is like, oh, yeah, yeah, well, you know, and I'm going, I'm like, Okay, so I'm doing this. And he's like, you're doing what? It's like, I'm leaving the corporate space, and I'm going to start. And he was like, wow, well, that comes out of the left field. And I was like, it doesn't. And it was like, really this moment where he's like, Well, I didn't think he would ever actually do it. And I was like, No. And, you know, people said, well, what are you doing? And I said I don't know. And they were like, no, like, they thought I had some big, crazy hand-branded secret plan, right? That I just like, wasn't ready to reveal yet. And I was like, No, I'm serious. I know that it's my time to go. I don't know exactly what I'm doing or where I'm going. But I like, you know, I've got experience and education and this desire to just jump. So here we go. And people were like, I because it's very uncharacteristic.

Meg:
Yes. But I think you know when you know, you know, it's Yeah.

Tiffany:
So, you know, touching a little bit on the cults and true crime and whatnot. How did you find your passion in this?

Meg:
Oh, my gosh. So I am like many other babies of the 80s. I grew up and the song, the soundtrack from “Unsolved Mysteries” is like the soundtrack of my childhood. My mom and I would sit in the living room in the evenings and watch Unsolved Mysteries. And I just remember it was, it was like the Choose Your Adventure books, but in real life, that's like, oh, my gosh, people are going missing aliens exist. There's Bigfoot in the woods. Like all of this is a thing. And honestly, it started there. Then I started reading True Crime books probably way too young. And I hope my mom never hears this because I know she'll feel bad about it. Way too young. I was convinced that Ted Bundy was outside of my bedroom window because we were going specifically Northwest like, oh, no, I was totally Yeah, didn't sleep for a few weeks, it was all good. But I just was always intrigued by the mystery, the unknown. And then when I got older, it got even more into how people think and act. And at the end of the day, we're all made of the same stuff. We're all as people built with the same, you know, blood, muscle bone, we're all created with the same stuff. But the fact that some people are wired so differently, and just what makes them that way, helps people be that way, how it can be okay to do some of the horrible things. And yeah.

Tiffany:
It's super interesting, super interesting. I used to commute a few times a month. It was like four hours each way, and not where there's like radio service. And so this was like when I found that people talked about podcasts for a long time. And I was always late to the trend. And I'm like, oh, maybe I'll check out these podcasts. And so you get to one thing and click on here, and maybe this did not. And so I ended up finding this time like really got into it. And then basically, I was listening to so much that I was like, I would have true crime stuff to listen to. And so that's how I got into like, the cults and the dictators. I found that there's Sylar, like the podcast. I don't know if you're familiar with precast, they have a whole series of podcasts. And so you know, their whole dictator series, super interesting, again, because it's this piece of how some people go about doing certain things. I also like American Greed. It is a funny one. I love the voice of American Greed. He's so great. But again, these people were listening, and you're like, I'm sorry, you did what? And you let us go for how long? And some of these people like they are truly committed to whether it is, you know, the cult or the dictatorship or you know, like business scheme, or whatever. And you think like, you have to believe in your life, you have to believe that this is the truth, to be able to carry this out for years, they carry these things out. Yeah, I find it fascinating.

Meg:
That's where it's crazy to me when it is like, Okay, this wasn't just a fly by night, like, Oh, I'm the Messiah. There you go. Like, it's the long game it is. And it truly is that whole idea of boiling a frog, you know, you put the frog in the pot of water, it's going to jump right out. But if you just turn it up slowly, and keep adding little bits of crazy. It's yeah.

Tiffany:
Well, it's interesting, because, you know, when I was kind of going through this, what am I going to do, and really trying to understand different parts of leadership and seeing how different people describe it. And you know, these people, whether they're leading cults or you know, like countries and like a dictator style or whatever, they truly can lead the people to follow them, even to crazy points where you're like, I'm like its craziness. And so it's like, what is it about their leadership style? And so as I was leaving, you know, and doing all of this, because I remember, as I was working through corporate there was this moment where when I joined the executive team, and the CEO said, you have to sit at the head of the table. And I was like, why? Super introverted, super shy. I'm like, but I sit over here. I have always said, I'm, super habitual. So I'm like, but this is my seat. And he was like, yes. But now you're leading the meeting, you have to sit at the table. And I was like, but it makes no difference. I'm like, what? And so but then I started, like, trying to, like, do more research as to like, how people were leading and how, why we were so super, you know, it's like down a rabbit hole of like, how is it relevant? And how does it tie together and stuff? But I, you know, I find the whole study of the human species in terms of actions and creating action and it's so, so fascinating.

Meg:
Like, I always want to know my husband because Google is my most used anything. I'm like, Hey, Google, how did this start? What did this happen? Where does that word originate? But like, when did that start? That Okay, sitting at the head of the table symbolizes, and then the rest of us, we accept it. Because it's ingrained in us from the first day going to work that the person sitting at the head of the table is obviously the one in charge. Like, where does that I didn't grow up in a house where we had like, ahead of the table, we had a little table in our kitchen that we sat at, and you sat where you sat, and looking back now my seat was actually the quote-unquote, head of the table, I was at the end, but I was also the one closest to the back door so I could let the dog out when we were eating. So I'm like, I, I don't know where that develops within our lives that we recognize those things. And then so quickly follow them.

Tiffany:
Mm-hmm. Yes, for sure. And I think that as much as we have, there's definitely been growth and progression and change. Still not as much in certain areas. And you think, you know, but why is that the way it is? And that's always right, like, but why that's my mom always says, when you were a kid, that was your question for everything, but why? And I feel like some of these things, you know, I'm, it's interesting how a lack of questions sometimes can leave things untouched in this life the way I've always been.

Mrg:
Yes. Well, I remember one of my clients in the past, had said that one of her biggest issues with the industry she was in was that every time she would ask a question, she was told, well, that's just that's the way it's always been. That's how it's always worked. And she's like, but why? Like, no, you can't tell me why. Like, sure it's worked in the past. But you know, things change and evolve. And I think it's the people you have to ask why for things to change. I mean, that's why people like us, we leave the corporate world because we're like, Okay, this is no longer fulfilling or fitting what I need it to in my life. I guess the change is like, we have to leave, we have to go, and yeah.

Tiffany:
Yeah, it's interesting. I saw this person on Tiktok, I have a Tiktok guilty pleasure. And she's a lawyer. And so I guess she likes to wear pink. I mean, pink is not my jam. But she wears head-to-toe pink suits, like in that movie with the blonde. And when she was like getting picked on and like made fun of and like this was like a thing where the guys were like razzing her about it. So she built an entire law firm, where everyone was like, I mean, it is like 100% Barbie pink everything but they're like kicking butt. And you're like, I love it. I mean, I would never do it. You could not pay me to go anywhere to paint a head-to-toe suit. But it's like, I love that. She's just like, decided, like, this is what I'm doing. And I don't care what everybody else says about the fact that it's like it makes her want to win more. Does it prove him wrong?

Meg:
I freaking love that. Well, and I think that so much of I mean, I know with my business myself, and I know you can probably speak to it too. There's always the whole idea of okay, well, when you start your own business, you have to narrow your niche down and you have to find a way to talk to this person and who is your ideal client? I know for me, I struggled with the niching down. I have a business coach and they were like, Well, no, you have to niche down and I'm like, No, I don't want to say I work with brunette women in their 40s who do this. Like no, I work with creative trendsetting. Whoop, believing badasses. That's my niche. I don't care who you are, what you look like, where you're at, that's if you fit in with yourself, you know, that's it.

Tiffany:
But to me that niching, you know, I've been I've heard and mental the same things and have talked about it to a few different people over, you know, the podcasts and whatnot. Because, you know, I mean, for what I do, specifically whether, you know, like I say, like the businesses I work with, whether your team like changes toilets, or organizes or house cleaning or, you know, is an architect or a therapist or photographer, what you do when you get there. I'm not helping you with that. I'm not. That's not my jam. That's your jam. My jam is all behind the seat. Yeah. And so whatever you do is what you do. And so I think that you know, what that has been, you hear like, you have to niche down you have to be down. And I do think your messaging needs to speak to someone, but I think that we often the way that we group that into like, oh, it's like this industry or this age, but really, for me, it's more about when someone is reading your website or they're reading your social media posts. They're like, yes, this person understands me. And it's just framing it differently. It's reaching out to a different group of people, they might share the same industry, but they might not. But they have something, there's some part of them that is like a common ground that when they are experiencing you and your brand was like, Yes, this person understands.

Meg:
Well, I'm doing it in a way that is authentic to you and is going to resonate with those people you want to connect with. I mean, if it's wearing the Barbie pink suit and heels, and having an entire law firm that does that, more power to you, like you said, That's not my jam, my wardrobe is mainly black because then it doesn't show up the coffee that I spill on myself every day. We're good. But I mean, you know, how you present yourself, how you talk, what you're putting out there? I don't feel like it has to fit into a box anymore, as it did for so long. Now, if you're being authentically you, people will recognize that people see it, and yeah.

Tiffany:
Yeah, I agree. So if you had one tangible tip for people to implement into their businesses, you can implement it this week and catch that win. What would that be?

Meg:
Honestly, when it comes to I mean, my jam is writing its words, it's that communication. And one tip for people is to stop second-guessing themselves. I know that that's easier said than done, of course, but to really lean into that authenticity, and know that what you're writing is what you're saying, your message, if it rings true to you, then it's not wrong. Put it out there. You know, I'm not saying give medical advice, but put it out there and be true to who you are. Because then you're going to connect with people in the right way. And it just feels so much better. It's such a relief, and it's such an empowering feeling to not be trying to fit into someone else's box.

Tiffany:
Yeah, yes. 100% agree. Well, it's been fantastic having you Meg and so where can people connect with you? If they're like, I need to work with Meg. I want to write a book or I want to touch base with you Learn some more where can they connect with you?

Meg:
I love it. All of the socials. If you look up Meg's rights, my website is just www.megs.rights.com.

Tiffany
Awesome. Awesome. And I'll be sure to link those below. Well, thank you so much for being here. It's been a pleasure.

Meg:
Of course. Thank you so much. It's been fun.

Tiffany:
Well, we are all out of time for today. If you guys have not joined the service-based business society or Facebook community, make sure you head on over to Facebook and we can continue the conversation. Be sure to also follow the show by going to any podcast app and searching surface-based business society. Click subscribe, click the fifth star, and leave us a written review.

Have a great week and we will see you soon