Sales: The Gatekeeper
Download MP3Hello, and welcome to the Service Based Business Society podcast. I'm your host, Tiffany Ann Bottcher. I left the corporate world to build my own businesses. And along the way, I've learned that scaling isn't all highlight reels. It's messy.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:It's hard, and it's totally worth it. As a mom of three, the author of the data driven method, and a serial entrepreneur, I know firsthand what it takes to build something bigger than yourself. This show is where we get real about entrepreneurship. The good, the bad, the beautiful, and yes, even the ugly. Each week, I'll pull back the curtain to share stories, lessons, and strategies that help ambitious entrepreneurs scale their success.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:So let's get started.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Ever feel like you're doing all the right things in your business? You're building systems, hiring a team, fine tuning your offer, yet the growth you're dreaming of still just feels out of reach? The truth is no matter how amazing your service is, none of it matters if people don't know you exist. In today's episode, I'm joined by Christopher Filipiak, a nationally recognized sales strategist and founder of christopherfilippiak.com. Christopher started his career as an engineer in Detroit, climbed the corporate ladder, earned his MBA in entrepreneurship, and then made the bold leap to leave the security behind and build his own business.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Over the years, he's helped CEOs, founders, and high performing sales teams master the art of authentic selling, guiding organizations from stuck to sales ready and transforming the revenue growth by aligning sales operations with real human connection. Christopher's approach isn't about manipulative tactics or rigid scripts. It's about courageous conversations, clear strategy, and a genuine commitment to helping others. His work has empowered business owners to not only grow revenue, but also grow as leaders, creating organizations that thrive long term. Today, we're going to deep dive into why sales is the key.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Why sales is the true gatekeeper of business success, even for the most service driven entrepreneurs. We're also going to talk about how to overcome the discomfort and fear of rejection that keeps so many founders stuck. We're going talk about the first steps to reverse engineering your revenue goals and building out a successful sales process that actually works. And why mastering sales is about helping people get to where they want to go, not pushing them where you want them to be. Whether you're a seasoned CEO or you're just starting out, this conversation will inspire you to see sales differently as an act of service, a pathway to freedom, and the heartbeat of a thriving business.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Hello, Christopher, and welcome to the show.
Christopher Filiipiack:Hey, Tiffany Ann. So good to be here today. Thanks for having me on the show, and I'm looking forward to having this conversation with you today.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Yes. I have been looking forward to recording this episode because I talked to a lot of business owners who are in one of two camps. One, everyone is super busy, trying to hire, trying to grow, trying to scale. And then there's these other people who really want to be there, but are really struggling with one thing and that is really driving sales. And they're, they're feeling like they can't kind of take it to the next level.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:So I am excited to have this conversation today. Before we dive into all of that, why don't we talk a little bit about how you got into the business space?
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah. I, I think about that. I've been thinking about that this week quite a bit. I don't know. There was something, like, from when I was very young that I always wanted to be an entrepreneur.
Christopher Filiipiack:And, you know, I could remember, like, leafing through, like, Inc Magazine and business magazines, like, in elementary school. Right? And, like, having those around and being interested in those. And so in my in my mind, I always I was like, I'm gonna be an entrepreneur. And I had no idea, like, what that actually meant or or how to do that.
Christopher Filiipiack:And I think a lot of it was just me understanding at a very young age that I wanted to be responsible for myself. Right? I wanted to take there was a level of, like, I wanna learn how to navigate in this world and be in this world without being dependent on other people. And for me, that was entrepreneurship. And and I think at that time, there was also, like, it's it's more now or has grown more over the last ten or twenty years where like, being an entrepreneur, right, is kind of like is like the same as being famous, you know?
Christopher Filiipiack:And so there's there's that there's that alert. There's the kind of that like rock star entrepreneur attraction, which isn't the place you want to enter entrepreneurship from. Like, you want to enter entrepreneurship from a place of love, like wanting and loving building businesses. Right? Not not being famous.
Christopher Filiipiack:There's a different cause for being famous. But that was it. And then so I started, you know, wherever I could, I was starting little businesses are always thinking about businesses. And then it was interesting because there was no, I didn't know how to start a business. And I thought I had, you know, I was kind of on this track of getting a job.
Christopher Filiipiack:Right. And I went down that path. I was an engineer, good at math, and ended up studying entrepreneurship in grad school when I, you know, my concentration for my MBA was entrepreneurship. And I don't know if that helped or or didn't, but I am where I am. Like, I finally made it into, like, owning my own business.
Christopher Filiipiack:So but that's how that's how it started, Tiffany. Yeah.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Interesting. It's it's funny it started so early for you. For me, it was the opposite. Although I did take entrepreneurship in grade 11. I don't remember much about the course, but I do remember thinking because at that point, I didn't feel like I really wanted to be an entrepreneur.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:I loved business. I loved the kind of competitive portion of business, but I really felt like I wanted to be part of a bigger organization, which did kind of spur, you know, first my career going that direction. But ultimately, I enjoyed the startup to, to scaling phase of business. And then it was, you know, as you get going, you're like, you know what? I think actually I, I do want to be a business owner and entrepreneur.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Now I have multiple businesses and, and have that kind of serial entrepreneur bug that, you know, first first you become a business owner and entrepreneur. And then of course, you just you just love it so much and you just keep going for sure.
Christopher Filiipiack:That's awesome. I also think, you know, I I can remember I read like, Rich Dad Poor Dad. Right? And that was not only just about entrepreneurship, it's a lot of, you know, how how to invest and think about money in general. But I think that book also like further, you know, I either sought that out because I wanted to be an entrepreneur or attracted it to me, you know, and then it was, like, supported that.
Christopher Filiipiack:I think that was, you know, one of the one of the books I read that kind of was like, oh, yeah, somehow somehow I have to figure out how to do this. So Right. Yeah.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:It's interesting how different kind of pieces you kind of mentioned having different, you know, magazines and then, you know, you read a specific book. And I I feel like everyone's kind of got that, you know, whether it was the book or the moment or the event that where, where something kind of splits in the road where you're, you think you're kind of on one trajectory and then all of a sudden you kind of are going in a different direction and super excited, super passionate. It's like something just kind of checks over. Like, it's like you hit another gear and it's, it's funny because it's not consistent. It's whatever kind of hits for someone, you know, that book might hit for one person.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:It might be something else completely different, but there's always, there's usually something that kind of spurs the passion to kind of dive really, really into it.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah, for sure. I think I think like deciding to start a business is is kind of a, unique path that people go on. And I think there needs to be kind of that that tipping point or that catalyst that that happens. And for me, when I when I think about that, what actually propelled me to start my businesses, you know, growing up, I was I was told, I remember I was like, you know, the career advice or the life advice was always, like, get a job at a I grew up in Detroit. So they're like, get a job as an engineer at, you know, one of the automotive companies.
Christopher Filiipiack:I worked at Ford, and they're like, go get your MBA, you'll be like, set for life. Right? That was it was like, the lead, you'll be fine, like, thirty years, you can retire and have a great life. And as I progressed and made progress down that path, I found that my success was getting less and less. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:And it was I was like, oh, this is interesting. So either that's not true. That doesn't hold up as true anymore. And I think there's value in education in those things that I've that I've learned and those experiences that I've had, no doubt. And I certainly bring them into the work that I do with my clients now.
Christopher Filiipiack:And it wasn't taking me to where I ultimately wanted to go. And I think that is because there was a misalignment with, like, who I am and what I wanted to do, right, and what my desires actually are. And so when that kind of unraveled or wasn't working for me anymore, that was kind of the tipping point where I'm like, man, it's now or never, Christopher. You know, it's like, either I'm gonna start something and figure it out or choose to stay stuck. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:A lot of people choose to put the blinders on and stay stuck to the best they choose to stay stuck because they're not they don't want to change and grow or make that. And that's what makes business owners and entrepreneurs so cool is that they have they use their courage to overcome any fear that's going on.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:It's simpler. That decision is, is almost similar to, to, you know, the decision in a business when you're trying to scale and you're, you're so focused on kind of the nuts and bolts, the operational pieces, you know, the visionary says, oh, I want to be, you know, I want be bigger. I want to get to 7 figures next year. And then the operational side of you is like, oh, except for we have this problem and that problem. And you, you kind of get sucked into that mentality and pushing through that in both the business side and even the decision to, you know, do the crazy thing and be an entrepreneur because you, you leave certainty.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:You know, I, like you said, I was an engineer. I did all of these things. Was making good money. I was educated. I was doing all these things.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Then you're like, you know what? I'm going to leave all of the certainty and instead I'm going to go and do this. And so many people are like, that is crazy. And I mean, I have talked about my decision to leave the corporate space many times on the podcast. And I think that decision for me was actually scarier than deciding to leave my first husband because it was like one of those, Oh my goodness.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:I, you know, I had all the ducks in a row, if you will. I had all the things that I thought I wanted. And then the decision to be like, you know what, actually I've decided that I don't necessarily want that. I did my MBA really close to the end of my corporate time and I was actually unfulfilled in what I was doing. And so I decided, Hey, I'm going to go back to school.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:I love school. So I was like, I'll go back to school, do my MBA and then I'll feel fulfilled. And I realized actually it was, I just needed to make a bigger change. It wasn't school related, but I finished my MBA just as I started my business. And the big joke is now, well, you know, the boss didn't really care about the MBA because the pay was still the same.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:You know, it wasn't really a, and I absolutely adored my MBA process and it was fantastic, but it definitely wasn't revenue generating and it definitely didn't provide any additional certainty as I was shifting into entrepreneurship. You know, it's kind of one of those, those three extra letters, but yeah, that's about that's about it.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah, I think those things that I mean, you you you move through life at your current level awareness, Tiffany, and and what your current desires are. And the faster you can move from one desire to the next desire. And, you know, whether it's whether it's your experience or your job or your education, like, all of those are absolutely required for you to become the person that you are. Right? Even, like, leaving a like, that's required for you to become the person that you are even all the bad shit that happens to you.
Christopher Filiipiack:Right? Or the good shit. Right? Like both,
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:both
Christopher Filiipiack:good and bad at the same time. Right? And that's why you learn, as you grow and you choose to grow to like, you know, look at your life with a sense of gratitude and acceptance for what what happens and anything that's unpleasant, right, or there's still trauma around or takes you out of alignment. That's where some skill sets around, you know, helping move through that or or work with that. But everything, you know, all those experiences, you know, whether they created the result you want or didn't, are absolutely necessary.
Christopher Filiipiack:And I think the more experiences you can have, right, the more you learn, the more you get dialed in on actually what you want to be doing. Yes.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Absolutely. Yeah. You, I, his name escapes me at this moment, but I see someone online and he interviews entrepreneurs, business owners, usually people who have become very wildly successful. If they do it on the street, they always kind of pretend like it's, Hey, by the way. But you see these interviews and almost every single one of them, you know, that he, one of the questions he asks is, did you ever have nothing?
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And almost every single one of them has some kind of moment that they share of like, Oh yeah, like it was bad. Like I, there was extreme failure or like my first two businesses failed. I think that we really get into this kind of rut of like, well, if it didn't fail, then I must run back to safety. And I feel like one of the biggest difference makers is really that ability to just keep, keep going to, to persevere and say, Hey, like it, it might not have gone exactly the way I want, but all that showed me was that that offer wasn't right. Or the way that I put that company together wasn't right.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And that if you really are passionate about continuing down the road to keep going, because lots of people have failed and then been wildly successful, it doesn't, you know, one failure doesn't mean that it's it's all failure.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah, I think I think a redefinition of what failure is is super helpful to people moving through their lives or growing businesses. And, you know, you only fail if you stop moving forward. Right. And it's really hard, you know, and this is this is one of the beautiful things about living in this country. It's, like, really hard to actually fail and die.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Yeah.
Christopher Filiipiack:And I joke about that, because I know there's, there's disparity around that all over, you know, our country and all over the world. But if you keep, if you're in the position to start a business, your body is screaming, like, look, like, don't don't do that. Don't do that because it's wired for survival, for change in growth, and happiness. So it's like, don't do that. Don't do this.
Christopher Filiipiack:Like, what if you die? Like, everything ends out like, what if you die? Right? Or lose it all. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:Totally. But if you can use your courage to step through that fear because that's just a a story, then you get to create a different experience for yourself, and you get to pick up data like the entrepreneurs that that person interviews where they're like, yeah, I've definitely hit, like, rock bottom or I've definitely had nothing multiple times. And when you go through that experience, whatever that is, you start to have information that goes, oh, you know what? Like, I had nothing, but I was okay. And I was able to, like, create anew.
Christopher Filiipiack:Oh, and then I had nothing again, and I was able to create anew. Right? And this is one of this is like a mindset shift, you know, that you can take with yourself. Like, if you've if you accumulated or even had any amount of money in your life, whether it's a dollar or a million dollars or $10,000,000, a $100,000,000, you know, there's so much worry, especially as you start to accumulate more and more wealth as an entrepreneur. You learn like, well, you know, that's actually super cool.
Christopher Filiipiack:Like, if I lost it all, that would be okay. It wouldn't be some part of you would feel bad about that, but it would be okay because you already know how to do that. You're already like, oh, I already know how to do that. And so because entrepreneurs, one of the main skills to develop is the skill of sales. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:And the ability to master sales and create whatever you want whenever you want it is is really, I think, the definition of financial freedom and freedom of it in itself. Right? Not having a bunch of money in the bank. Right? It's interesting.
Christopher Filiipiack:Like lottery winners. Right?
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Totally. Totally. It's interesting because I have, you know, I've I've been in the accounting operation space. So in corporate, I kind of sat opposing to the sales team, if you will. They came up with these hair brain ideas and I was always the voice of reason that was kind of like, Hey, well, let's really look at how that might play out or can we actually deliver that?
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And so when I started my business, I, you know, and people are what are you going to be doing? And this was a big question when I left and I thought, well, you know, like I over a decade of experience and I have all this education and I'm going to figure it out. Pretty resourceful. I can figure it out. But I, I, I realized immediately that it didn't matter how great my offer was.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:It did not matter if I could take business owners and help them become millionaires next week. That didn't matter. If no one knew who I was and no one knew what I did. Nothing else mattered. And so I realized very quickly that that skill, I had never, I mean, I've been in, I'd been in school for like eight years at that point.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:I'd done all these things. That skill, had not a drip, not an idea of really what to do. I mean, like sure you like, you know, you sell things along the way and it was, it was actually Dan Lok who said I dove into sales. Like I was like, okay, what do I need to, what do I need to learn? This is not really my skill set, but better figure it out real quick if I want to make a go of this.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And he said, you know, we were, I did this three day Dan Lok intensive and he was talking about like, if you've ever convinced your partner to do something that they didn't really want to do, or you've convinced your kids that like, this is a good idea, even though they don't really like that, you know, that that's probably not their first choice. You sold them on something. So you're like, let's remove this, this stigma of like, you know, we're not, we're not trying to sell a used car that's broken down to some like unsuspecting victim. He's like, take this concept and get rid of it. If you are helping someone get to where you want them to be, even if that's your kid eating broccoli, then you are selling something.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:You've already done it. And I, that was very interesting to me.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah. And even more powerfully than you getting them to where you want them to be, like you helping them get to where they want to be. Yes. Then you're really selling them. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:Because that sales is a is a gift. It's a act of love. Right? It is something you do for other people and and receive money in exchange for that service. You know?
Christopher Filiipiack:And Yeah. Yeah. I think there's a lot of misinformation, a lot of salesy culture, a lot of manipulation that can happen, and it has been taught. And I think that reframing that and coming from an authentic place and that place of love and service and really understanding what sales is actually about can really help people overcome that resistance to fully leaning into to sales, which shows up for, you know, you see it see it all over and with early see it with all sorts of CEOs. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:Whether they're they're brand new founders, whether they're seasoned CEOs, you know, as as they start to understand I mean, eventually, like a CEO, all CEOs are like, yeah, I understand revenues, like, and revenue growth is an important part of my business. But whether they've done the work to come into relationship with money and strangers and abundance and the skill of sales, like, that can that can vary from person to person. And they don't teach like, it's not teach. It's not taught. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:And I think this is one of the the biggest gaps is all the stuff that actually matters to humans and and functioning. Right? Like relationships, sales, money, all those things, like, they're not they're not actually taught. They're they're not actually taught. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:You know, most of the educational system is set up so that people can get a job and work for someone else, you know. And when you develop a skill set around sales, you really take back your own authority and your own sovereignty, and you can operate in the world in a different way. And you're right. We're always selling from the moment we're born. Like, we're always exchanging.
Christopher Filiipiack:The technical definition of a sales exchange of money for goods or services. And I think it's important to understand that. But we're always exchanging with each other. Like, that's what humans do. We're always exchanging.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Mhmm. Yeah. I think it does. You know, sales kind of has this negative connotation and, and I, it it's required, you know, there's no business out there that isn't like you're, you don't have a business if you're not making some kind of, if we reframe it and just saying we're making an offer and your business will be compensated, remove the word sales. You're making some kind of offer of something in exchange for something else.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And in turn, that is how you, you know, are going to grow your business and pay your team and, you know, cover your overhead and all of these types of things. And so when we kind of remove that, but I think there's still a lot of messaging out there that is the other way. I still get, I love, I love being sold to well. It's something, you know, especially after going through so much sales, I'm like, okay, you know, oh, they went this to right. And I, so I find it, I find it fascinating.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:That's how my mind works. It's kind of breaking something down, but you get on a, you know, you get into a situation with someone where their sales process is so rigid that they will only sell to you one way. So my husband and I were on a walk just over the weekend. You can tell it's, it's, you know, definitely not Christmas light season yet, but there's a whole bunch of houses that have Christmas lights up. And they're this like new, the new style you like leave up all the time and you can program with your phone.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And he's like, he's like, this is so weird that like all these houses, you know, it was kind of this conversation of like, well, that's weird at this time of year. And I said, Oh, actually this, this guy stopped by our house and they wanted to like do a demo block kind of thing. So they were trying to sell everybody so that then they had this, this street that lots of people have these lights and they could use that for their sales pitch. He's like, and I was like, oh yeah. And he's like, well, how much was it?
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And I said, you know, the funny thing is, is I'm not sure because he wouldn't tell me unless he could meet with the two of us at the same time. And he's like, okay, well, why? And so right now we're like kind of chattering back and forth about this. And I said, yeah, I was, I'm like, I was interested. It was, you know, I'm, I'm kind of the, okay, well we put the Christmas lights up, so maybe we pay to put them up once and leave them up.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:So like, but he would not give me the price unless he met in person with the two of us. And I said, he's totally trying to remove the, oh, I'll talk to my spouse objection. Right? I mean, I'm sure he went through a whole bunch of sales pitches where he kept hearing, I'll talk to my, I'll talk to my spouse. I'll talk to my husband.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:I'll talk to my wife. And so he thought, well, you know what? I'm going to scrap that objection. And instead we're just going to meet with everybody together and we're going to sell these lights. Except for like, that wasn't practical for my husband and I to meet at the times I can make, you know, it's like, but there are people that they could make a decision.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:I can make a decision on the Christmas lights. I don't need my husband to hold my hand for that. And so it was kind of one of those I'm like, he wouldn't tell me. And I was like, well, I guess we're not then. Like, it was like one of those, like, I I was interested, but I couldn't meet his sales requirement.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah. I mean, designing sales process is a real skill set. Right? And and getting your system set up so that you can quickly create and have sales conversations and mastering those sales conversations. And a lot of a lot of people design a lot of business owners, a lot of CEOs, a lot of sales ops ops professionals design sales systems from what I call like a place of fear, instead of place of truth.
Christopher Filiipiack:And so they're trying to introduce all of this stuff to either get their own needs met, right, or their own they're either their own, like, physical monetary needs met or their their emotional needs met or protect themselves from someone saying no. Right? And so then they design processes that have all these extra steps and all these things in them that aren't actually required, and actually are more about the the business than the helping the other person. Right? And you want to design your sales system or your sales process to be helpful to the person you're talking to, to not waste their time, to help create clarity, and to make it easy to make sales.
Christopher Filiipiack:So I'm all for some structure in a sales process because it does help depending on what your business is, it does help determine if you can actually help the person determine if the fit is there determine if they actually want what they say they want. But in your Christmas light situation, it sounds like you were interested in the conversation. Either the system or the process didn't support the conversation, or there was just a lack of skill to recognize that you were pretty close to being ready to buy like you were interested to buy.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:I had my card out. I was ready. He was like, no buying for you. And I was like, okay.
Christopher Filiipiack:Chocolate, Tiffany. No, you cannot have these Christmas lights.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:You cannot have them. Yeah. But that it's it's interesting. Right? And it's, it's, there's so many different ways of selling out there and, and oftentimes people start their businesses and you see so often, well, I put my website up and I got my business cards printed and nothing happened.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And you're like, okay. And then, you know, the next step is people say, okay, well now I hear that I need SEO. People will get to my website. If I get this SEO service, some people that's like the next step. So people then get their SEO service and they get their traffic up on their website and they're like, nothing happened.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And so I always say, Hey, like we have to really look at like where in the journey we are, because if no one knows you exist, I mean, I was there, you know, five years ago. That's, that's one set of problems and one set of recommendations and one, you know, process and correction. And then you kind of get further down the path. Okay. Well, now you've got more people to your website and they saw your website and they saw what you were offering.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And obviously it wasn't what they were looking for because they didn't, they didn't take that next step. So, I mean, there can be a number of reasons why that didn't take place and that becomes the biggest piece is figuring out what problem you're trying to solve in your process, but you know, can't jump to immediately. They didn't like my offer if no one actually saw it. And so really kind of deciding, Hey, where in the process are we so that we can solve the problem that we're actually on?
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah. It's kind of like you were mentioning when you started your own business, you know, you had a great it didn't doesn't matter if you can put a million dollars in someone's pocket if no one know knows. And I've I've really seen, you know, as technology has advanced, as social media has become extremely prevalent, as children and young adults and adults are using these tools more and more to communicate, like, asynchronously and using tools so they don't even have to communicate with each other, with AI, right, there's been a real a real decline in how to sell. Right? And and people are trying to avoid sales, which is just conversations with another person.
Christopher Filiipiack:Right? So there's been this drop in in skill set around understanding how to have real conversations. And as a consequence of that, because a sales conversation is is really a highly specialized conversation that requires, like, some skill to be able to lead. There has been there's been people trying to figure out how to, like you said, like, do SEO or marketing or automate and build all these things. And then they're like, nothing happened.
Christopher Filiipiack:Right? And it's like, nothing happened. And I was meeting with a sales team last week doing a VIP day for them. And we were looking at the results. And there were there were months where the sales team, you know, and I've I've been there, like, I'm not like, pointing fingers.
Christopher Filiipiack:I'm not judging. I'm saying like, there's whole months that go by where you haven't made a sale. Right? Months and months, like, I've seen this over and over and again, as I've worked with hundreds and hundreds of businesses where they'll have whole months go by, where they haven't made a sale. And it's like, isn't that so interesting?
Christopher Filiipiack:You used a whole month to make zero sales. Like, how did you do that? That's incredible. Like, how did you manage that? Curious about that.
Christopher Filiipiack:Oh, two months, no sales. Like, what was going on? And that's where you're like, nothing happened because there was a misinterpretation of what the actual causes of the effect you want in sales. And and that's where, you know, sales means actually talking to people and asking them to buy from you in the most direct way possible. And so that's gonna mean calling people on the phone.
Christopher Filiipiack:That's gonna be reaching out and emailing the people who are already in your telephone, the people who are next door to you, right, in your neighbors. Like, it's not about trying to, like, sell people all over the country. It's like, can you ask the people who you already know who you have proximity to? Right? Ask those people.
Christopher Filiipiack:Go, hey. I have a feeling I can help you, or, hey. I have this offer, or I have this thing, and really talk really talking to people just as all like, all day as much as much as you can. And, Tiffany, it's you know, even I resist that at at some level. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:Like, we all do. We'd all rather, like, stay where it's comfortable, and our subconscious minds are like, I don't wanna talk to people and ask them to buy. Right? Because if money if a lot of if more money comes into your business, as much as we all want that, that's gonna require you to change and grow. And so some part of you is always resisting that.
Christopher Filiipiack:And so that's that's one of the things to overcome and and receive coaching and help and support around. But that's how you get to a place where you're spending all of your time doing a lot of stuff, but you're not actually making progress. You're not actually changing and growing. You're not actually bringing more money into your business.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:That's interesting. I thought of, I thought of two things as you were talking there. And, and one was, you know, especially as you're, if you're as a business owner and you're growing your sales team, lot of times business owners are that primary, you know, first seller and, and then they, you know, we're going to have to scale that. And one of the things I think is really interesting is a lot of times positions that they call sales are actually not really, they're not revenue generating, which to me salesperson would need to be actively selling something. I feel like there's kind of this blend between almost like customer service account manager kind of order taker and actual like, and, and really generating that next sale.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And I think a lot of times, you know, I, I actually have an acquaintance and she was in a, what was called the sales role and then left there to go chase a much bigger salary in a different sales role. And it was very interesting because what that new sales role was asking her to do was unlike anything she'd ever done. They were asking her to, you know, get out there and sell, go out there and generate new business and make new connections and do all these things. Whereas in the previous role, she ultimately had been taking care of their current portfolio, you know, really. She was amazing at that.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Her, her customers loved her. And I think that was, you know, there's this piece where they bought from her and kept coming back to her because she always took good care of them, but she wasn't really generating to new clients. And so, you know, and when we're building a team or even thinking about your own role is really kind of, am I really just kind of keeping the portfolio I have and therefore kind of growing organically a little bit? Or are we actually getting like out there and really generating whether that's a new, you know, new clients, new, new business, two clients, that type of thing.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah. You can have anything you want, and you can make any amount of money you want. And you can add revenue really, really quickly. And it's gonna require a skill around actually generating new clients. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:Most service based businesses, you know, a lot of that work comes from existing clients, relationships and referrals. And you can like, you can grow at a moderate pace, or you can keep things pretty, keep things moving forward. But eventually, that isn't that is strategy you want. I mean, those things are important, but it's not the complete strategy and developing competence around, you know, what I would just traditionally call, like, outbound sales, right, or sales or new business development is a game changer for business and especially for young businesses. One of the one of the most important one of, like, the benefits of developing that competency is when you do that, you're out constantly talking to the market.
Christopher Filiipiack:And because the market's changing so often, when you're talking to new new people, you're getting information about how to improve your offer. Right? So there's, like, this bonus benefit, you know, and I'm a like, this is one of the reasons why I'm a big advocate for CEOs involvement in sales or high level business development because it's really important for those CEOs to be out talking to the market to understand what's happening with their clients. And in many, many cases, they're the best positioned person to drive revenue for the business at all levels. You know?
Christopher Filiipiack:Businesses up to $200,000,000 in revenue. And even, like, the largest CEOs where maybe they're not involved in, you know, the daily sales motion or, you know, doing sales conversations themselves, they're still outselling. They're they're speaking. They're podcasting. They're interviewing.
Christopher Filiipiack:They're talking to their best clients. They're working on the largest deals. And so Mhmm. Across all different types, there's there's a real there's a real gift in learning how to to master your own sales work.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Absolutely. Absolutely. The second thing I I thought as you're kind of sharing that was was the willingness to be uncomfortable. I mean, I think a lot of people don't, no one likes being rejected. No one likes being told no.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And I think that kind of willingness to kind of pick yourself up, dust yourself off and not take it personally and kind of go another round if you will, is, you know, it comes back that same conversation about being willing to leave security, leave, you know, like leave the corporate space or leave the job that has a nine to five paycheck and being willing to do that. And I think that the decision to be a business owner is, is not an easy one. It's not for everyone. And it, because it's like, first you have to make that decision that you're going to leave the safety there. Then you're going to make the decision to talk to, you know, like you said, talk to the people that, know, talk to your network, talk to being willing to pick up the phone and talk to someone you don't know at all and say, Hey, this is what I do.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:This is how I can help you. It's not an easy road unless you have an offer that is like guaranteed to like, you know, people will say no, along the way, might not be a fit timing wise, you know, it might not be the best ROI for them in that moment. And so you're going to hear no. And so it's, I always say the business owners are a little bit of a crazy bunch because they, they want to do those things. They've decided that this is the life and the journey that they want to live.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:So it's a it's a unique group of the population.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah, definitely. Yeah. There there's a level of discomfort when you're changing and growing. I mean, that's that's the nature. And I think I think so much of what makes sales easier is doing the inner work, Tiffany Ann, to come into alignment with who you really are and how you actually help people.
Christopher Filiipiack:And then understanding, like, staying, like, unattached, like, in a in a sales conversation. Right? Actually understanding just being so just knowing who you are and your your relationship with yourself at such a, like, a a powerful way that you're operating from, like, what's called, like, an internal locus of control. Right? And so then you can show up really grounded and also aware that you're gonna make sales if you continue to reach out and talk to people and understanding that some of those people are gonna be a fit to buy.
Christopher Filiipiack:Some of those people are not gonna be a fit to buy. And not not showing up to help that person whether they buy or don't buy. Right?
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Totally.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah. And that that takes there's growth. There's a lot of internal growth there. And I think if you go on that journey to do that, you become more you you become more aware of the wholeness of who you are. And that's I think that's a really strong foundation from which to build a sales effort and a business.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Yeah. I think that service based sales is very interesting because it's it's typically not. I mean, there obviously there is situations where it is, but I would say there's many situations where it's not kind of one and done. And if you think to like the the people who sell the, like the knives at the market, you you get your knife and you know, buy now and you get your second knife and whatever. Realistically, those people take those knives home.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:They may love them. They may not love them, but ultimately they're not going to see that person again. I mean, maybe next year at the same market or whatever, but it's, it's very kind of one and done. It's, it's the same thing as buying something on Amazon. You get it home and sometimes you like it and sometimes you don't, but there isn't really a lot of, sometimes you return it.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:With service, a lot of times there's an interaction with that person while you perform the service. So selling to someone who isn't a great fit. Now I was actually talking to a client just, just last week and she had what would be kind of like that probably worst job of her and her business is like eight years old and just not a fit on client. And she says, I knew it wasn't a great fit, But the team was quiet at that moment. It just fit into the schedule.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:So we kind of just kept going and sure. Yeah, we'll do it. And in the end it wasn't a great fit and the service has like drained the team. It's been hard to get paid. You know, the client's not happy.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Team's not happy because it just wasn't a fit. And I think that, you know, like when you're talking about really getting to know this, have those interactions because sometimes it's not just a, not a fit from the other person where the customer might be like, Hey, this is sometimes it's just, you actually can't help that person as much as maybe you thought from the initial set of facts. Once you dive in, you're like, Hey, we actually, we don't really offer this particular service. We kind of offer something close, but actually what you need is over here. Or once you get taught, you know, the person thinks they have you know, it's just back to that kind of SEO analogy, you know, the person thinks they have a one problem where they're, and it's like, actually you just don't have any traffic here.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Sometimes they don't necessarily know what problem they're trying to solve. And so if you sell, even though you're actually not the solution, you have to continue to actually deliver on that. It doesn't serve anybody well.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah, for sure. Yeah. There's, there's, there is like, you want to make sure that it's good and generative for both people and that it's profitable for both people and that you're gonna enjoy working with a person. And when you when you have a really robust pipeline, right, and you know how to make more money than you need, meaning your your income or your revenue is above the the companies in your personal need line, and you understand that you can create any amount of wealth whenever you want it, you get to be more choosy about the clients. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:And and, like, influential about the clients that you work with. And that's been a that's been a real growth edge in in my business. You know, when you're starting, you're just gonna take whatever you can get because you're just starting out. Right? And Yeah.
Christopher Filiipiack:Your clients are help helping you as much as you're helping them. Right? But as you earn, you get better and better at what you do. You know, I'm at the point where I'm like, I'm really good at what I do, and I really, really know how to help people. And I know because I've had experience doing it myself and going through the going through the growth and doing the tech doing the technical work and doing the activity work, and you get to a point where, you know, there I won't just work with any client, right?
Christopher Filiipiack:I'm looking to work for a client that wants to do something beautiful with their sales operations, that really wants to change and grow and become a different person. Mhmm. Yeah. I'll help put money in their pocket and help them grow revenue. But if they're just like, I just want more money, but I don't wanna do sales, and I don't wanna change and grow, and I don't wanna figure out my systems and right?
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Yeah. Totally. So if someone is is sitting there thinking, you know what? Sales has been my biggest, oh my goodness. I I'm not at that need line yet or or I really wanna grow my business.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:A lot of times it's people want to take that next step. Maybe they know they need to hire, you know, middle management, but they know they need to really be able to support that by driving sales. What are those first few steps that they should really be working through?
Christopher Filiipiack:I think it's, think the first and most important thing is to create clarity on what it is that you actually want, what the number is that you're actually looking to achieve. Because once you understand that you can use the law of cause and effect to reverse engineer what's actually gonna cause that. You know? And that's that's hard. It's not something, you know, again, like, we don't teach our children to explore, really explore what it is they want.
Christopher Filiipiack:Often, we're telling them they can't have what they want. Right? We're not encouraging them to to dream and and explore their desires and learning how to achieve what they what they want. So then as adults, like, we're not honest with ourselves about what we actually want and desire. And if we're not honest, then we're building strategies and systems from a place of inauthenticity, and that's gonna create resistance in achieving that.
Christopher Filiipiack:So the first step is clarity on what it is you want. And then I think it's looking at the organization as a whole. Right? And going like, hey, what are the foundational pieces that we need to put in place that are gonna allow us to achieve that result? And that's one of the things, you know, that that I work with my clients are, and I'm very, like, proud of that I've been able to develop this idea of a sales ready organization and go like, hey, like, these are some of the fundamental pieces that need to be in place to allow you to to get to that level.
Christopher Filiipiack:You know, I'm from Detroit, and I love cars. So I love to think about, like, like, a race car team. Right? And so, like, a car, your car, your vehicle is a system of systems. You have the engine and the chassis suspension and the electronics and the aerodynamics.
Christopher Filiipiack:So you have all these things coming together that allow the vehicle to move quickly. And then you have the driver and the pick crew and the leadership. And a business is very similar to that. You have the you have the vehicle, which is your sales operations, and there's certain things that are needed in that. You need, you know, you need to know your market.
Christopher Filiipiack:You need your message. You need your offer. You need your systems. You need your techno your stack, you need marketing to create conversation, you need sales tools to facilitate those conversations. So you have all these pieces.
Christopher Filiipiack:And a lot of times what I see is I see people overbuild or overbuild in the areas they're uncomfortable, or they're overbuild in areas they're most comfortable with and underbuild in areas that are actually required to take them forward. So an understanding of what's actually required, I think can be very, very helpful. So if you have that expertise and you can look at your business and go, I understand these fundamental building blocks, I know which pieces are important, then you can set up a project to start building out those pieces to take you to whatever level you want want to go. Once you know what you want, it's about just setting up the conditions. If you don't know what those pieces are, and this is why people spend a lot of time making zero sales in a month.
Christopher Filiipiack:Right? Because they they they think that one thing is gonna drive revenue, but they're actually missing or part of their system needs to be improved. Having having someone help you with that can be can be a logical next step as well.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Absolutely. Sometimes it takes that having that person kind of on the outside, you know, that expression, see the forest through the trees, because sometimes, you know, especially as business owners, you know, you, you've built it, you feel like everything is required. You feel everything is important. You know, it's, it's, these are your non negotiables and sometimes it's someone coming in and saying like, Hey, this might've been another non negotiable, non negotiable, you know, at the beginning, first couple of years of business, but is, do we need to reevaluate that now? Like, where are we really with this now?
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Because sometimes it's, it's not as required or, you know, there's a key thing that we just overlook because it's, oh, it's always been done that way. And so having that additional support and help really can move the needle.
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah, for sure. There's there's building a business, I think, thinking a lot of ways is solved. Right? I think what makes it challenging is just your own like, what's going on with with the people. I think the the fundamentals or tactics about building a business, like, you know, there's that's been well documented.
Christopher Filiipiack:People have been building business for a long time now. And what where it gets difficult is with your own internal resistance. Right? Where you're like, okay, I'm committed to this thing, but this thing we're all committed to what we're currently doing. Because, again, we're our brains are wired for safety and survival, not for change and growth.
Christopher Filiipiack:So you're gonna do what's most comfortable unless you're you're aware enough or conscious enough to go like, I can see this in a different way. And what actually I need to be doing is different than what I'm currently different doing. And that's always the case when you want a different result. And in outside, it's hard to see that yourself. Right?
Christopher Filiipiack:Absolutely. Yeah.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:So if if people have been listening to the episode and thinking, this this sounds like something I really need some help on, how what are the different ways that they can work with you and maybe check out additional information about you online?
Christopher Filiipiack:Yeah. So there's a couple of resources. So my website's christopherfilippiak.com, and I'm on LinkedIn at christopherfilippiak. People can reach out to me at either of those spots. As a gift to the listeners of the show, I offer a free sales ready organization assessment, which kind of helps lay out those fundamental building blocks.
Christopher Filiipiack:And it'll show you what you're doing well, kind of what's working, what needs improvement, like where are the things that you can best focus your time and energy and what that needs to be. And then what are the things that are complete blind spots or you're missing? And you can take that on my website. There's also a bunch of articles on my blog that I've written over, like, the last six months or so, about, the case for CEO sales, what it means to be sales ready, while things like feeling your feelings and being embodied in such an important part of sales. That's a that's an amazing resource there.
Christopher Filiipiack:I invite all listeners to check that out as well.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Awesome. I'll be sure to link, link those in the show notes. Well, Christopher, I really appreciate you being here today. Sales really is the lifeblood. I always, I always had a good laugh because someone said to me, I think it was one season two of the podcast, they asked me, what did I think the most important skill to running a business was?
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:And being in the finance ops tech side, they, they had a good laugh that I said it was sales because ultimately it really all comes back to, if no one knows you exist, if no one knows what you do, whatever benefit and amazingness that you can do, it doesn't matter. And it really it becomes sales becomes the gatekeeper of success ultimately.
Christopher Filiipiack:Thanks so much for having me on the show. I really enjoyed the conversation and way that this rolled out, and I hope it was super helpful to the listeners.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:That's all the time we have for today. But the conversation doesn't stop here. Be sure to subscribe to the Service Based Business Society podcast on all of your favorite apps. And if you're hanging out over on YouTube, search for Tiffany and Bocher. Your likes, comments, and shares don't just help the show, they help more entrepreneurs find the real stories and strategies that they need to scale.
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:Until next time, keep pushing, keep building,
Tiffany-Ann Bottcher:and I'll catch you in the next episode.
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